Peelenium

[Stig]

Martin Wheatley wrote:
> >I'm not suggesting the records in the Peelennium so far don't "interest
> >Peel musically", far from it, but the lack of variety in form and style
> >makes me think that actually there's not a great range of stuff
> 
> He has chosen to have music hall records pre WW1 because that is what
> he wants to hear.  It is an artistic choice not the abscence of alternatives

Well I'll take your word for that, as I said it was purely the lack of
variety so far that made me wonder whether it was a lack of choice more
than anything that was the deciding factor. As I also said, I wasn't
claiming to be an authority on pre WWI records. 

> Peel for all his great knowledge cannot know about everything and at this
> stage he doesn't know enough to make the choices without doing research that he
> doesn't have time to do
> The Gramophone library would have connections to all sorts of experts so I
> think it very probably all he has done is to ask them to give him minidisks
> of 4 tracks of Music Hall music for every year up to a certain point.

If this is the case I wonder upon what he has based his 'artistic
choice' of music hall as a representative genre of the first 12 years of
the century. I always thought with Peel it was a case of playing the
records he likes whoever they're by and whatever style they are - you
think he has decided to delegate choice of records for the Peelennium by
genre at this early point? I had assumed that's the last thing he'd do
but you could well be right; it may even be a case that if he was doing
the choosing himself he would have come up with a more varied range than
we've been getting, if as you say there's a whole range of records from
the first decade of the century that has been neglected - if that's true
and there are many varied genres available to him on vinyl, I simply
can't accept that none of it would be 'as interesting' as music hall.
And if that's true, as Stuart said it is quite an opportunity missed
even if it's not intended to be a serious or definitive look at the
development of pop music throughout the century.

> >> Since the
> >> researcher on the Peel show is Stig's generation
> 
> >You almost seem to imply here that you define people's worth by
> >generation
> 
> I was simply pointing out rather clumsily that a pop music researcher is
> unlikely to be an expert on early 1900s music bearing in mind that the BBC tend to
> employ people like Jo Whiley to do the job!

Apology accepted

> I wrote
> > The true mark of the scholar.  Comparing something you know
> > with something you know bugger all about.  You'll go far!
> > There is a career in journalism awaiting you :-)
> >
> It's IRONY Stig - note the smiley at the end.  You have been on Fallnet and
> should understand that. Whereas the pile of personal insults you have
> directed at me is just gratuitously offensive

I wrote:
> >Not for the first time I find myself asking you: does this actually
> >mean anything or is it simply evidence of a petty and pompous little
> >mind? ;)
 
> Offensive, uncalled for and inappropriate to this group

To quote you 8 lines up, please note the smiley at the end! It was me
responding to your barbed shaft of wit in very much the same vein. 

You previously wrote:
> Stuart McHugh replied
> >Miaow! 
> 
> I know!  I just got irritated because ... <snip> 

As for my "string of personal insults", I really don't think I have done
any such thing. If you read what I actually wrote I have simply been
dismissing several of the "miaow" aspects of your mail which made
offensive assumptions and generalisations--not least about an entire
generation--as a display of shallow pomposity. Apologies if this
analysis of your words caused you offense, but at certain points your
words seemed to display these qualities. Don't confuse it with personal
insult: I know nothing about you except the evidence you present me in
ascii text, you may well be a lovely person

> >If my words have any definable intention I would suggest that it
> >is to explore and question rather to than project and impose any
> >supposedly final or expert meaning onto anything as arbitrary as
> >culture.
> 
> And just how does that square up with dismissing most pre 1950s
> music as you have done.  Exploring and questioning rather than
> just making assumptions that anything you don't know can't be any good
> and doesn't exist is all I've been asking you to do

Well if you look at what I've actually been saying, at no point have I
"dismissed most pre 1950s music"; what I *have* done is questioned the
availability of as wide a range of records from that era as there is
today. My assumptions about a period I know little about are intended to
be framed as statements open to debate not posited as absolute truth, so
I challenge your assertion that I have "dismissed whole swathes of
music" and "made assumptions that anything you don't know can't be any
good and doesn't exist". I have done no such thing! I think what I
actually first said that you picked me up on was that "a more varied
range of music first started being put on records" after the fifties;
while clumsily phrased this clearly does not "dismiss most pre 50s
music" or claim it "can't be any good and doesn't exist". It makes a
general statement about the development of the recording industry, the
increasingly common use of recording equipment over time and the
corresponding increase in the ease and sophistication of the possibility
for experimentation within the medium. 

> Despite Stig's obvious desire to I have no intention of taking part
> in a flame war and I won't post further

It's nice to hear you sounding quite reasonable ;) Although please don't
stop posting on the subject of the Peelennium I think your opinions and
knowledge are valuable and what you have to say interests me. "Obvious 
desire": again, if you read the words that I actually wrote you will 
realise that what I have been saying all along is that flaming is petty 
and small-minded. I, you and a couple of others have stated that certain 
aspects of your posts were tending towards the cat-like and I was 
responding to these words of yours. I think this debate is too 
interesting and important to be bogged down in such evident 
misunderstanding. 


Stig, humming "i like everybody" by the cuban boys

--
jmsmall@...